Josh DeTar:  Welcome to another episode of the digital banking [00:02:00] podcast. My guest today is Scott Fieber, the chief strategy officer for cook solutions group. Look, I had the pleasure of meeting Scott, gosh, almost a decade ago. Now at this point, look, I’m sure you find amazing people in other industries too. Maybe like healthcare to name one, but the community FI space is home to so many truly wonderful people.

And I personally put Scott in that group. It’s not because he’s a nice guy or because he made an intro to an FI for me or anything like that. It’s because his foundation is rooted in so much more. His foundation is focused on serving, serving in his church, serving in his community, serving in his nonprofit he and his wife started. Now Scott will also be the first one to tell you, look, we all got to work. Making money is a necessary evil. We need to put food on the table for our families. But if I’m gonna have to work, I want to do something that aligns to my core value of service. And it’s why bringing value to Community FIs [00:03:00] is in such direct alignment to him.

Community FIs are built to serve. Now Scott is also one of those total characters though, too. And how he accomplishes his goals of service and adds value to our industry is Makes me chuckle sometimes. If you’ve ever met him at a conference, you probably know what I’m talking about. He’s usually pretty easy to spot in either a gold sequined jacket, some crazy hat or like guns shooting money out.

What I appreciate though is it’s all genuine. It’s not a gimmick to get personal attention. It’s not rooted in some deep insecurity or desire to land a sale. It’s because he cares so much about creating deep connections with people to learn how to serve and support them that he really wants to go above and beyond in everything he does.

Scott and his wife have been married for 15 years. He has three amazing kids and he says everything he does in his work and professional life is to set a good example for them and to build a world where he’s happy for them to grow up in. Now you might think with an intro like this, we’re just [00:04:00] going to talk about a bunch of kumbaya fluff and stuff.

But Scott’s also kind of my go to SME for all things security and more. He really does have his finger on the pulse of what’s impacting community FIs right now. And he’s got some really solid tips and trips to be thinking about to create real solutions. So trust me, there’ll be some gold advice

in that jacket of his by the end of this.

Uh, you know, actually I was starting to think about it, Scott, I’m a little disappointed in you, man. Like am I not good enough to get the gold jacket? Like you’re, Oh, it was behind you the whole time. I didn’t even know.

Scott: yeah. I had it on the wall actually for the longest time. But then the flags took precedence. I didn’t need to shake things up. No, you know what? That gold jacket has been a blessing and a curse. Like, we wore it for one thing and it kind of took on its own life and then now I have to put my pride aside and just keep wearing it because everywhere I go people are like, hey, where’s the jacket?

I’m like, nah. Yeah, I got it here.

Josh: Oh, well it was,

Scott: to a show and didn’t have it and I got strung up for it. So I got to wear it now.[00:05:00] 

Josh: well, we were in San Diego late last year and I remember I was texting, we were texting back and forth like, Hey, where are you? I don’t know. Where are you? And then literally I look across and I’m not even kidding. Scott’s got to be a solid 75 yards from me in this giant convention hall and I see the gold jacket.

And so I just sent him a picture of like zoomed in five X and all you could see was the jacket. And I was like, Oh no, I found you. So it works.

Scott: Someone’s spying on me. Yeah, you’re right. Yeah, it’s, uh, it works, I guess. Yeah. For whatever that is. It works. Yeah. So

Josh: I know. Isn’t it funny? Like we become the things That you get known for, right? It’s like, I get the same thing. I even get, at this point, Scott, if I fly through PDX and I’m not wearing my red chucks, I’ll have TSA even be like, where’s your red Chucks? I’m like, are you kidding? Like can I not take a personal flight every once in a while?

Like,[00:06:00] 

Scott: No, you are typhoid. You have to live and breathe

Josh: I have my red Chucks. Like, but at least your jacket, like mine gets buried down below. Right? Like at least yours is higher up and people can see it. I had somebody tell me I have to start wearing my shoes on my head. I’d be easier to spot.

Scott: you go. Yeah. Yeah. Um, yeah, it’s funny because the jacket came about because we were doing a game show at one of our tech summits and that was my game show jacket. It was literally a 20 purchase on Amazon. That’s all it was. It’s like, I gotta find me a game show jacket. That’s it. That’s all the thought that came into it.

And then it just snowballed into this thing of now I have to wear it everywhere I go.

Josh: Is it still the same one you got? Like, is it lasted that long?

Scott: No, actually, funny story. So that was the year we were doing, um, tech summons at different Topgolfs. So we went to like LA, then Phoenix, then Salt Lake, then somewhere else. And it was like by the sixth one, it had become a thing, right?

So even the Topgolf employees were like, look for the guy wearing the gold jacket. That’s your customer. That’s where you got it. He’ll work with you on all this stuff. And, and so the last one, it was in Scottsdale. [00:07:00] One of the employees, um, had down syndrome and he was like excited to see me, this guy in the gold jacket.

So he greeted us with, with a couple of other workers from Topgolf. And I was like, Hey, it’s at the end, it was our last show of the tour. And so I told the kid, I’m like, Hey, you know what? You can have my jacket if you want. He’s like, Whoa, really? And so I gave the jacket to him. And it was even cooler too, cause we were giving away, it’s right when we launched our conveyance application.

And so I said, Hey, tell you what, if you can hit this bullseye, everyone here can get like a discount off of conveyance. And he walked up full confidence, gold jacket and all, and just threw a dart and like everyone won. Like it was the craziest thing. And anyways, he left and then he was, you could see him working cause he was just there greeting people, just giving people pictures and hugging everyone in his new gold jacket.

Um, so that’s when I thought the gold jacket was gone. And then sure enough, I had to like go back and to another show. I’d be like, well, where’s your gold jacket? So I had to buy a second one. So this is actually number two, but number one, somewhere in Scottsdale at a Topgolf, if you end up going there, he might be wearing it still.

I don’t know.

Josh: I had no, [00:08:00] for like, full transparency, I had no idea I was setting you up for that mic drop when I asked that question. But like, if that doesn’t validate what I said when I introduced Scott as a guest, I don’t know what does. Um, but no, I, you know, and that’s funny, like that, that leads me to, You know, even when Scott and I were just getting ready to start this podcast today, before we hit record, we kind of made the joke that it’s like, Um, we’ve got so much history at this point and so many like different like Scott seems to be the guy I go to like when I want to get on a soapbox and I just want to like rant about something because he’s usually got an equally or more impressive rant about something else or similar or the exact same thing.

And so we were joking that like this podcast could totally turn into just Scott and I going on these epic like personal and professional rants and our different soapboxes. And we would be absolute, like we would have a blast and we could go on for hours and you all might actually find it somewhat entertaining too and find some value in it.

But then we’re like, [00:09:00] Oh, you know, there’s actually some other like real good stuff that we can talk about. Um, but you know, I wanted to kind of start with the thing that I feel like always comes up with you and I, right. And like the soapbox we seem to always get on. And I think why you and I are kind of the, um, I guess personalities we are in our industry and like why we talk a lot about the things that we do and the way we do is, um, community financial institutions have really been hampered in their ability to innovate in tech. And it has come from, unfortunately, some of the vendor space and kind of rewarding people for bad behavior and almost getting boxed into not being able to take advantage of things that are happening so much faster outside of our industry and Um, you know, this is not, this is not a, like a conversation of just, you know, David versus Goliath and trying to talk about why, you know, small companies may be [00:10:00] better than others.

I don’t even think it has anything to do with size necessarily. We know some really great companies in our industry that are really big, right? And some really small companies that are not doing the right things. But, um, you know, working with vendors. That that want to enable an ecosystem of fast paced innovation and kind of leveraging what you have to very quickly make advancements is something that you seem to get on a soapbox about a lot.

Scott: it’s, it’s to your point, it’s like, it’s frustrating when you’re passionate about something and you see the pains that they’re going through and you know that these bigger companies sometimes have the right solution too. And then they just buy the business. Right. Or like, Hey, like they’re so frustrated with like you, it’s, here’s a good example.

I guess, right. You sit down in a meeting and they go on a rant, like their own personal soapbox about how much they hate or dislike this company. . And next [00:11:00] thing you know, they’re like, eh, we’re re-upping for another three years. It’s like, why ? Like, what are we doing here? Why are we doing this? Um, but to be honest, like they either don’t have an option.

Like they’re so ingrained with that they have to. Or it’s just like, it takes a lot of guts too, I guess, to like, in some cases peel some pieces off and actually prove. And in some cases it might just cause it comes down to money. Like you, you get so many discounts by doing so much with some of these bigger companies you have to.

I don’t know, but to me it’s just like if I could wave one magic wand and fix that, like I do feel like it is at the very end of the world, like the crux of the lack of innovation is because of these massive companies that are holding everyone hostage. Like if, if that wasn’t there, I do, I truly do feel like, especially in the banking industry, innovation will be way further down the road than it is today.

That’s just my personal opinion, but

Josh: You know, I think, I mean, you, you almost have validation in that point in that you look at some of the, the newer [00:12:00] fintech entrance into financial services, right? And how much faster they’re able to move because they’re quite simply not tied into some of that legacy tech, right? Or to your point, like some of those legacy contracts or just legacy complexity.

Um, you know, one of the things I was thinking about, you even mentioned this before we started recording, right? Like you were talking about how. Starbucks has become a massive depository because of how much money people keep loaded in their Starbucks app. And it made me think back to, I had a good buddy, Mr.

Danny Payne from Jack Henry on the podcast probably about a year ago or so. And one of the things that Danny was talking about was he said he loved to go to conferences and ask people like how many financial services apps do you have on your phone? And he was like, I usually get an answer of like, I can’t remember exactly what he said, but like [00:13:00] three to five or something.

Right. And he goes, and then I would ask them if they’d be willing to go through their phone with me and I’ll tell you which ones actually have financial services plugged into them. And he’s like that number quickly skyrockets to like 20 or 30. Right. And one of the big examples was like Starbucks. And having you load money into it.

And so to some degree, when we’re talking about the challenges that community financial institutions are facing, we go through deposit challenges, right? Where we’re looking for deposits. And if we’ve got, say we’re 100, 000 member credit union and we have 100, 000 members that all have 10 bucks in their Starbucks app, that’s a million dollars.

That’s a million dollars that’s not deposited into our financial institution. That’s just sitting in Starbucks. So that’s kind of my long winded way of getting to like what you were saying is, is, you know, you, not only do you have some of these challenges, we have a whole new entrant [00:14:00] of like neo banks and FinTechs that are coming in fresh.

We’ve also, like we’re getting beat up on all sides in terms of quote, quote, unquote, offering innovation and ways for people to use their money in even things like Starbucks and whoever would have thought, I mean, when Starbucks first started as a coffee company in Seattle, would you have thought like they’re going to come for my deposits? That one was not on my bingo card, dude. I don’t know about yours.

Scott: Amazon starting out as this book company that now is what it is to like, it’s funny, like how these companies, yeah, take, take shape over years of innovation, but again, like they’re not, they’re never satisfied. I think that’s the difference. Right. I think some of these other ones are, they’re just satisfied with when they have a valuable, you know, a real competitor, they just buy them up and then Remove the competition by, by just buying it.

Right. Which is again, that’s, that’s stopping innovation, right. And it’s tracks, unfortunately. I’m with you. I’m starting to count. I’m looking at my phone now too. Like I’m wondering how many apps I’ve got that have banking tied to it. It’s probably too many.[00:15:00] 

Josh: Right. Well, and um, that kind of goes back to what you were saying about, um, just some of the challenges of, um, Um, you know, partnering with companies where maybe the best interest of the financial institution isn’t there. And you think about, you get, uh, the types of companies servicing the community FIs that care about earnings per share over customer satisfaction and value add.

And then at the same time, if you kind of use that same example of like, who are they beholden to, who do they care about, right? For them, it’s their shareholders.

Scott: Right.

Josh: Or for whatever, maybe it’s a publicly held company and they just care about, you know, padding their owners pockets or whatever it is, right? But the focus is not the customer is the point.

And then you even look at, okay, let’s talk about Starbucks and Amazon and Venmo and all of these folks that are now providing financial services. Again, where is their allegiance? It’s not to you, the [00:16:00] person who has the Starbucks app. I mean, it is to some degree cause they just, they want more of your money as a customer.

But again, they’re kind of beholden to their shareholders, right? That Neo bank is focused on customer acquisition, right? And profit per customer. And that’s not a community financial institution. Like that’s not a credit union. It’s like, that’s not woven into their DNA. They care about serving their members and improving their financial lives.

And what I find really interesting is in our space, when it’s like, I want to do business with companies that think like big banks and how they operate. But I want my customers to do business with me because of the service and the relationship. Yeah.

Scott: Yep. Yeah. It’s interesting. Like you go meet with any, I would say pretty much any community FI. The number one answer when you ask them what separates them from everyone else is they’re going to say service, right? And it’s just like okay if that’s the answer right and I totally agree with it By the way, like I think there’s other things that [00:17:00] they should differentiate themselves with too beyond that But if you feel like that’s your core value you should be asking or shouldn’t you be asking the same thing from your vendor partners?

like if they’re not also tied into service then Then you’re not lining up on values there and you probably shouldn’t be doing business with each other in my opinion I think the other good like If you’re wondering like who falls in that category of like partner versus vendor, like we hear a lot about that lately too, is like, when’s the last time or last time you met with them?

Did they ask you that your opinion on something, did they ask you to collaborate on something? Did they hear you out versus just coming in with a canned pitch on, Hey, it’s time for me to sell you something more. Here’s, here’s the next thing we got to sell you and pushing something down your throat you probably don’t want, but like, are they actually collaborating with you, getting to know your business, getting to know what drives you, And providing introductions to other, you know, good, um, providers out in the world, like just helping with that thought process and that thought leadership.

Because in my opinion, the money’s going to come eventually. If you’re a good partner and you’re truly genuinely interested in what’s [00:18:00] making that company successful and you’re there for the long haul with them, the money’s going to come eventually. Like, but you gotta, you gotta solidify yourself I think in that, in that lens.

And if these companies aren’t asking for that type of stuff, I think that’s a pretty telltale sign of, of, to your point, what they’re interested in. That’s the. Again, bottom line or shareholder value, whatever else it might be like you mentioned.

Josh: Yeah. And I think, um, like that’s such a, an interesting, it’s hard to quantify, I think a lot of times, right? Is how, how collaborative are you? How relational are you? Cause you know, it’s really easy for one person in the organization to say that to you, but it is a culture of that organization and the way it’s actually like down to.

What is their ownership structure? Who are their investors? What is their, you know, what are they looking for? What does success look like to them? The executive leadership team, like what are the metrics they’re being measured against and how do you kind of identify that? And [00:19:00] you know, that may be different for different types of partners.

Like maybe there’s a, you know, a certain type of partner that quite frankly, you just need to check, mark a box. They just need to do this certain thing for you and you just need to get it at the lowest price possible. And it to be set it and forget it. There’s probably a lot of those, right? But there’s probably some really key important relationships that to your point, like you should be trying to validate that by like, how often do I actually come to the table with them and sit down and collaborate?

And then what comes of that? Like, does, does it turn into anything other than just some notes on somebody’s computer that go up into thin air and, and then never get, you know, heard from again. And, um,

Scott: I think to that same point, like if, if the latter is true, like you’re saying, then in that case, you probably should be doing more business with that company because you’re going to be able to get more integration and more, a deeper relationship through what they’re

Process the whiteboard, the bubble sessions, like all this stuff. And then from there. Something actually comes of it because odds are, at least [00:20:00] from my experience, if I go meet with a credit union or a bank and they’re telling me that they’re having an issue and they’re struggling through it, pretty much everyone else is probably gonna be in that same boat, right?

And so from our lens, like it makes it really easy to say, yeah, let’s figure out something to help our customers here. But the truth piece though, is even if that’s not the case, a lot of times we’ll still end up doing it for them because again, that’s part of being that good partner, um, and just moving in that right direction.

But it’s, I don’t know, it’s something that I just, I do feel like, man, until like, Generally, we get past this bottleneck. I just, it’s going to be interesting to see what the next few years hold as far as when it comes to innovation, where, um, banks and credit unions like end up going, but we’ll

Josh: I, I personally will, you know, get on the soapbox of, I would love to see us get to the point and we’re a ways away from this, but in this industry where it’s so easy to just rip out technology,

Scott: Oh yeah.

Josh: I would absolutely love it. Like, and this is going to sound really unselfserving to me, but I would absolutely love it if you could just say, you know what?[00:21:00] 

Like I don’t like my digital banking vendor. I’m done with them. I’m just going to go. website and download theirs. And in five minutes, I’m on a new platform,

Scott: Yeah.

Josh: Because when you get to that level, then it’s a more competitive marketplace. You have to differentiate more on service and innovation. As opposed to, I got you so locked in cause this thing is so stinking hard to freaking rip out and replace that to your point, you’re going to sit there and you’re going to whine and complain about me all day long and then you’re going to re sign my renewal cause you ain’t going nowhere. Right? And I think that’s why too, Scott, like I, I always feel like I have this, um, you know, kind of light bulb moment. Anytime I get on this conversation with somebody on the podcast, I don’t envy a lot of times being in some of these folks shoes at the financial institution because it’s a really difficult job and it’s a really hard to navigate [00:22:00] all of these different complexities.

And to your point, it’s like you’re, you’re trying to streamline things. You’re trying to make things work together better. You’re trying to negotiate prices. You’re trying to build relationships. You’re trying to innovate and evolve. And you’ve got this dependency and that dependency. And you know, who’s great today may not be great tomorrow.

And, uh, it’s, it’s a really hard thing to navigate. And especially when it’s like everything is changing so fast around us, but it’s really hard to change things for a lot of different reasons. very quickly in our industry.

Scott: I think pipe dream wise, like it’s to me, it all comes down to the core. Unfortunately, like that’s something you can’t today, right? Maybe your point, like you can go down, download a new core at some point in the future. I don’t know, but like, you’re so tied to that. And that’s, you know, where some of these bigger companies lie, but then they start getting into everything else and you just can’t, you can’t get away.

It’s, it’s tough. Uh, but the funny thing is like, I’m seeing right now with, with, I know we [00:23:00] overheard about AI. We don’t want to talk about anymore. Like everything that we talk about all these days is AI, but it’s like, you can literally no code required. Like go out and develop your own app in minutes, right?

You can go out and develop a website that used to cost tens of thousands of dollars in minutes. Like it’s insane and only going to get incredibly better. So like, I’m optimistic to a point to say, gosh, like could there be a spot where we could get free and like not have all these different platforms.

And I mean, yeah, we, we, we’ve shown in the past on just presentations that we’ve done to have just the number of platforms that banks and credit unions use on a day to day basis to, I mean, it’s in the hundreds and sometimes thousands of different systems that they have to do in order to run their job.

Um, my brother in law, he’s a, uh, branch manager for bank, um, And he said, yeah, he was like, he was shadowing one of his tellers just kind of, and she had to use 16 different systems on a day to day basis to get her job done. Like different browsers, different applications. I’m like, holy smokes. He’s like, yeah, no wonder when you try to change your, your address, like it’s such a [00:24:00] cumbersome task.

Or right. Or you switch to a new digital banking product or you do a new core system or you do whatever. And all of a sudden three or four things are broken because it’s so archaic and old and all the different ways that, you know, these different platforms are connecting to each other. It’s, it’s, yeah, to your point, I don’t envy anybody one bit that’s in those shoes trying to make those decisions.

It’s just for me, like from a belief system, it’s so counterintuitive to say, I, I don’t love this company, but yeah, I’m going to keep paying them and keep signing up and keep going forward with them. Um, but on the same note, like you’re saying, they don’t really have much of an option in some cases and it’s, And it’s really brave and resource intensive to, to try to break away from it.

So,

Josh: You know, on that point though, man, I, I think we’re naive to think that with the pace of just compute power and computing technology and network speeds at the pace that it is accelerating, we are absolutely naive to think that Anything we do is safe,

Scott: Oh,

Josh: I think anything and everything is [00:25:00] pretty much up for disruption at some point.

I mean, like you’re saying, I mean, you know, I can go, I’m a knucklehead dude. Like I, I’m not a technologist,

Scott: Sure.

Josh: even I can go use some of the new AI tools to like write code and stuff.

Scott: Yeah,

Josh: That’s crazy. So you get somebody who actually knows what they’re doing. And yeah, I think it’s pretty crazy if we think we’re so safe that in whatever time frame, somebody couldn’t write a program using AI to say, build a better digital banking platform than Typhones.

So if you’re not thinking about that, or leveraging those tools yourself to advance and innovate, I think you’re in a sticky spot.

Scott: think you’d be a fool to have a strategic direction or plan that’s out more than a couple of years. Because it’s totally going to be, yeah, irrelevant by that point. Anyway, like you got to work in the now, like, [00:26:00] and it’s, it’s interesting to see that, but yeah, I mean, any, any bit of stagnant, uh, strategy is going to be, going to be a tough spot here in a little

Josh: Can I tell you a funny story? So this was even just a couple of years ago, we responded to an RFP for a financial institution that will go unnamed.

Scott: Okay.

Josh: And as a part of that RFP, they asked us for our 10 year roadmap. And I was like, I don’t even know how to respond to this. So I went to our, um, our head of product.

And I was like, dude, we got this question. Like, what do you want me to put? And it was just hilarious. I genuinely wish I had this on recording. Cause it’s one of those things that I would actually go back and watch again. He went on the most epic rant of like, this is ridiculous. If any tech company has a 10 year roadmap, it’s because it’ll take them 10 years to actually build anything.

They don’t know what’s going to happen in 10 years. Like, I don’t know what’s going to happen tomorrow, you know? And, but I think the point is really valid, right? Is especially at the pace at which technology evolves. I mean, you think back to three [00:27:00] years ago, right? And how little the mainstream was using AI

Scott: Oh yeah,

Josh: it’s completely night and day different.

Now, what’s interesting is, is that for a lot of people, they think that like AI came about overnight when they started to see like chat GPT in the wild. That was kind of like when AI arrived, but this stuff’s been around for a long time. Um, It’s been getting worked on, but it just kind of reached that critical mass and then all of a sudden it just accelerates like crazy.

And so to your point, it’s like, we don’t know what’s going to happen in a year, two years, three years. You have to be building strategies to be prepared for change. Not saying this is exactly what I’m going to do three, five, seven, 10 years from now. They ain’t gonna work. Not in today’s world.

Scott: What’s even crazy is like, we feel like AI is going fast now though. Like wait six months, like this time next year, AI is going to be a totally [00:28:00] different animal than it is right now. That’s going to be more mind blowing in my opinion. So like, yeah, it’s yeah. Get your popcorn, buckle up. I think it’s going to be interesting.

Oh,

Josh: of, you know, one of the things you were talking about earlier, I wanted to come back to Scott was, um, you know, talking about just the pluses and minuses to all of a sudden, you know, one company providing so many different services. And I think sometimes that gets a bad rap, but I think there’s also a really positive to that. Right. And so we’re talking about like the advent of AI and maybe this company that you really love working with. Um, you know, wasn’t doing anything in this space, but because they had something similar that now because of this new advent of technology could help them to do a totally new vertical for you and solve real cool problems for you with existing technology or existing things you’re getting from them.

That’s very different than just the other example you gave of just gobbling up competitors and saying, well, now [00:29:00] I offer everything. It all kind of stinks and none of it works well together. That’s an example of one company doing 10 things wrong, but you can also get an example of one company doing 10 things really, really well because they were thoughtful about collaborating with their customers and saying, Oh, you know what?

This wasn’t on our roadmap to do. This isn’t a product that we offer, but you know what? Actually, this is a problem we could solve for you. This makes a lot of sense, right?

Scott: Yeah, I think interesting thought that we’ve had. We actually talked about this with our customers at our last tech summit was obviously there’s been a ton of like ATM fraud lately. Um, and part of that struggle is actually catching these bad guys. Let’s say you get a guy that shows up to an ATM and they’re selling a skimming device at X, Y, Z credit union.

Every single time you just follow that trend, it goes right up the interstate to, or down the interstate. Like it’s, Without fail, right? So we’re like, man, how cool would it could be is if we could then proactively notify people, like, [00:30:00] okay. Like if someone just got hit here, you’re 20 miles north, buckle up.

They’re probably coming tomorrow. Right. But like, again, different systems make that really difficult. Right. But to your point, like, okay, if we’ve got. That common user group here, and we can see that we can start sharing that data more effectively We can stop things from happening, right? And so yeah, I’m CSG is one where we talk about bundle and save all the time.

I feel like i’m flow from progressive like every time i’m talking to a customer right it’s like Yeah, there’s some things that we absolutely say go all in with CSG on things. But to your point, like it’s how you go about doing it and the reason behind it is well beyond just the dollars and cents. And because you have to, you don’t have any other option to go anywhere else.

Our hope is, is that the integration piece is critical. Like once you get multiple pieces together, the ability to then tie that all together. and make things, um, you know, work for your, for your benefit, for your, not only your, your customers, but also for your employees is huge from our perspective, right?

It’s just saying, we want to make your lives [00:31:00] easier. I want to make your customers lives easier. Let’s figure out the technology and the partnerships with others. To make that happen. Right. Um, so yeah, I’m yeah. Integration for us is, is a big piece. And I think sometimes, yeah, when you have a lot of that bundled in together, it makes it a heck of a lot easier versus trying to coordinate up sometimes with other bigger companies to get them to, to pay attention to hang out with you and not charge you 10, 000 just for a phone call, that kind of thing.

Yep.

Josh: when, um, when you were talking about that, I was, I was thinking about, um, that comes down to like, what is your thought process? What’s your starting point? Right. And if your starting point is, I have a solution looking for a problem, right? Like I, I saw this cool new thing this company offers at a conference.

Like how can I use it to make my business more efficient or how can I use it to get more members or how can I drive more deposits using that thing that I saw that was really [00:32:00] cool versus saying I have a thing that I’m trying to accomplish. What are the ways that I could accomplish that? Because sometimes there’s more than one way to get there.

But if you start from the get there, you’re never going to see those other things or the other problems that you could have solved, right? And you know, you, you gave me a really fascinating example when we were talking, um, I think at a conference recently. Right. And I don’t even know what you intended to like, tell me about this, but it kind of always stuck with me.

And I wanted to talk to you more about it when we, when we recorded this podcast, but you were saying something about, um, like you were, you were talking to a customer and they were trying to like bring in this super sophisticated system. to heat map track where people were going and their branches and understand lobby traffic and all of this and like they’re looking at this exponentially expensive system to do all of these things and all these different sensors [00:33:00] and you were like you know you have cameras that we use for security they track all of that you could just add heat mapping to the cameras and you’d that right and so that’s an example of they had found a solution without thinking about, well, what am I actually trying to accomplish?

Oh, it’s that like, are there other ways to accomplish that with even existing technology so that I can innovate faster?

Scott: Yeah, it’s a, it’s interesting sign on our side. It frustrates me to no end too, but like the number of customers. That use analytics at CSG is like Scarily low like and again the interesting part is like it doesn’t cost a ton of money Like it’s in fact in a lot of cases it’s free because it comes, you know with with the systems But I think to your point like they’re lacking the use cases behind this So yeah That was one where they’re trying to cat track customer sentiment like Are people happy when they come into our branch and they want even to get to a point where they can actually hear voice and like You know, can they detect demeanor in some of those pieces too?[00:34:00] 

And so yeah, that’s kind of where our light bulbs are like, well, we’re not doing that today But all we got to do is flip this one switch Again, the cost is going to be this much compared to this much And there’s no need to introduce any new vendors any new products any new anything and you’re good to go um It’s crazy.

We had the same thing with, um, a customer that was dealing with hook and chain attacks. So like, this is where criminals back up with a tractor or a stolen truck and yank the ATM off the island and just, like, screw, like, card skimming, right? That’s for, like, amateurs. I don’t want to have to take the card data, then make cards, and then steal people’s money.

I’m just gonna take the money out of the

Josh: I’m literally just going to take my tractor downtown.

Scott: Right. Like, you know what? Like, good job guys. Genius mode. I approve. Like, yes, applaud your thinking. Um, so yeah, so they’re just taking, they’re stealing tractors from across the street. They’re stealing cars, wrapping a chain around and just yanking these ATMs off, grabbing the cash and being done.

So, uh, we had a customer in California come to us and say, Hey, like, I don’t want to, there’s other options in the marketplace that could spend [00:35:00] 10, 20, 000 of just ugly things to make this. Again, and we kind of said, well, what if, right? Like, what if we just use the camera and some analytics and a sensor and maybe a speaker, a couple hundred bucks and IOT devices and fix it.

And they’re like, yeah, absolutely. I’d rather do that than spend 10 grand on this. It’s like, okay. So like, but again, it’s the existing technology, existing vendor, just thinking to your point about how we can solve this versus trying to go outside of that. And, um, yeah, it’s interesting. I think sometimes when you can leverage to the fullest extent, what you have, uh, I would bet if you were to go back in and look at your current platforms, how much of it you’re using of its full capabilities is probably pretty small.

It’s probably

Josh: you know,

Scott: percent of

Josh: that is such a challenge, man. I mean, like I’ll fall on the sword. I think, you know. We could do a better job of this too. It’s like how many times do perspective customers get to see kind of the demo of the latest and greatest and current [00:36:00] customers, they themselves and we, the vendors just think, well, you’re good.

You’re on the product. Right. And that goes back to what you were saying earlier of like, you have to have those relationships and those conversations. Yeah. where you’re really kind of coming to the table and collaborating, but you also have to tell each other what you’re working on to even know, right?

Like if that customer had never come to you and even had the conversation because they were like, Hey, look, CSG doesn’t do like marketing analytics for heat mapping of traffic in our branches. So why would we ever talk to them about that? Right? If that conversation never happens, then the, the great idea never comes of it.

But if you’ve developed really great relationships with your partners where you’re able to just have a conversation, you’re like, yeah, Scott, you know, so we’ve got a couple of strategic initiatives we’re working on this year. Like one of them is this kind of cool project that we’re doing and, you know, heat mapping and all of this.

Then you start to have conversations that are outside the norm. Um, and that is where then [00:37:00] all of a sudden you’re like, Oh, well, you know, my, my company that was securing your ATM is also now doing, you know, marketing analytics for heat tracking of your, and that totally sounds out in left field, but actually it makes a lot of sense.

Right. And I think that’s where you can actually like find the value or the, find the ability to kind of move faster given all the challenges we kind of talked about earlier.

Scott: Yeah, no, and I’m with you, like, shame on us too, like, I’ll fall on the sword absolutely too for that reason that people don’t use analytics, I think it’s, it’s our fault, because we haven’t helped them figure out how and what to use, like, every demo we do of our system always shows analytics, but then we go and install something without it, and it’s like, well, what the heck, why not?

Well, it’s because we didn’t have marketing in the call, right? We didn’t have retail on the call. We didn’t have ops on the call. We’re always talking to the security person. Right. And they got their view of what they want to have done here. And then on the same side, it’s like, okay, well, let’s say you are doing just simple, like line crossing.

I just want to know how many people come into my branch and out of my branch every day. Well, what are you going to do with that data? [00:38:00] Like without a good conversation, you’re not going to know. And so until you know that there’s no reason to have the data because then no one knows what they’re doing with it.

So let’s not even turn the analytic on. Fair. Right. So like that’s on us, in my opinion, to say, let’s help you figure this out. Because the technology is there, right? You’re, in some cases, you’re already paying for it. It’s like, let’s use it. Um, and so yeah, it’s, it’s part of that collaboration there for sure of just saying, hey, let’s think outside the box.

Let’s get more people involved. Let’s get that think tank going. Um, because yeah, odds are there’s technology sitting there on the sideline that other people within that organization could be using and they just don’t know about it.

Josh: Yeah. Well, that’s why I said to you like, man, I don’t envy some of the folks, you know, trying to piece all this stuff together from inside the four walls of, you know, a credit union or a community bank because it is, there’s so many of these different systems. And as one person kind of trying to see the whole picture, it’s really hard to know like, Oh, hot dang, I did not actually know that our, you know, security camera system.

[00:39:00] That, you know, this person bought to make sure nobody smashes a window after we’ve closed at five 30 and no one’s here could also feed my marketing team with data on how many people enter the branch at what times with what sentiment, right? And tag it to what transactions did they do while they were there and then feed that into their marketing engine.

All right. That’s. That’s a stretch sometimes when we’re trying to find some bigger fish.

Scott: yeah, no, it’s, uh, it’s interesting for sure. I think, but yeah, it’s sometimes I’m curious too, like on the relationship side of sometimes banks create, you just make siloed decisions. I mean, just so the same do we, I mean, any company does that. Right. Um, it’s like, how do you, how do you. know when to raise the flag and say, let’s think about bringing in this other department.

Um, and I think that kind [00:40:00] of goes in tune with, are you aware of the overall company initiatives outside of your department? And if you are, then that flag would go off, right? Um, if I’m the security manager and say, Hey, yeah, this is something that my ops team could use, but you don’t know that unless you know, kind of the overarching plan of what are we trying to solve for in the branch and where’s my piece of that puzzle.

Um, so. Yeah, that’s, uh, it’s, it’s, yeah, it’s the same frustrating, but fun innovation piece that we spend in all the time. We were just figuring out how we can help the customers. Um, but sometimes it’s helping ourselves from ourselves and helping them from themselves too, and we’re kind of together.

Josh: Yeah. I mean, I don’t think I’ve, I don’t know about you, but I don’t think I’ve ever worked for a company where you’ve had, you know, perfect visibility across every initiative. Because at the same time, like it’s always that balance of having the right people involved so that you do get that stuff, but you also don’t want too many hands in cookie jars.

Because that can create a whole nother can of worms where it’s like perfect case in point, right? Let’s, let’s just keep going [00:41:00] down this thread of, let’s say the, um, you know, I don’t know who would be the buyer, like a credit union for like the security cameras.

Scott: Look at facilities, manager, security officer,

Josh: so they’re the person that’s looking at, okay, it’s time for us to upgrade our camera system.

Scott: Yeah.

Josh: And they’ve got a very specific set of things that they’re trying to accomplish for that. They’ve got a budget for that. At what point would they want to say, we should pull marketing into this too. They should have a hand in helping me pick our security cameras. Right. And then all of a sudden you’ve got the marketing person that’s like, well, no, but I want the higher resolution one.

And I want the one that, Oh, that one’s in beige. Like, no, no, no, no. That clashes with our colors. I want, I want black ones. Right. And now it takes you like 18 months to pick out new cameras. That is. And you’ve lost all this time. But at the same time, if you didn’t involve them, you may never have known that they would have found really valuable insights into the data that those [00:42:00] cameras could feed them about traffic coming into the branch.

So it’s like, it’s a total, how do you decide, right? And that’s probably gonna be different at every organization.

Scott: Yeah. Well, I think back to our initial conversation too, I think that’s when you find out is the vendor or the partner you’re working with actually in it for the money or are they in it for the right reason too? Like, I’m totally fine with it taking longer to get the right solution in place than just to get something done quickly and get the sell off the street and move on.

Um, the cool thing about that though is you could, with, talking security specifically, you can kind of do that, right? You can get the cameras in place, get them doing what they’re normally doing. It’s like, Hey. Yeah, if there’s a robbery, I got the footage to show it and that’s good, right? But then can we have the follow up conversation later say, hey, by the way, software only update, we can start helping out, helping out the retail team.

Cool. Let’s have a conversation and figure it out. Um, but yeah, it’s, again, there’s no, no silver bullet, silver bullet to it. And unfortunately, I don’t think either, but, um, it is interesting. I would think if I would just, again, you probably know who your core partners are, right? There’s probably just a [00:43:00] handful of them.

I would challenge everyone to be meeting with them as regularly as it makes sense to really kind of unveil and bring, even if you think it’s, Oh, this isn’t a security thing or this isn’t a digital banking thing. I want to talk to you guys about X, Y, or Z. Cause odds are like, you’re going to know somebody in the industry that does it if you don’t do it.

And then you’re getting good, honest feedback from people that you trust versus just trying to, trying to find it on Google or trying to find it at a trade show or just organically, you know, getting it out of some random place. Yeah,

Josh: Um, but, but what is funny is actually Scott did introduce me to this FI. So I guess I do have to recount my words in the intro, but Scott introduced me to Tracy Miller from pioneer. that’s one of the things that I think is so incredibly special about that woman. She’s so good at being really, really thoughtful [00:44:00] about she’ll, I bet you anything like we’ve never actually checked this Scott and I think it’d be really funny to you sometime. I bet you anything. She has the exact same conversation with you and then with me or vice versa about these are the strategic things that I’m trying to accomplish and whatever because, and she doesn’t like, she doesn’t put a filter on it and say, well, I’m going to talk to Scott about these things and I’m going to talk to Josh about these things.

She’s like, I’m going to talk to all of my. you know, key partners about everything I’m trying to solve and then collectively they as an ecosystem need to help support me in finding the ways to solve the problems I’m trying to solve. Right. I

Scott: probably gonna have the same

Josh: good at that. What’s that?

Scott: the thing. We’re probably gonna have the same answers too. It’s probably the thing like, if you’re, let’s say, you know, either one of us do core banking, right? But if she says, hey, I’m thinking about switching out my core. I’m going to go to RFP. She’s going to call me and say, hey, Scott, what are you hearing?

Right? They’re going to call you. Hey, Josh, what are you hearing? Right? And we’re probably going to say the same thing. [00:45:00] Hey, these two or three. I’ve been hearing really good things about their conversions, I’ve been really hearing good things about their, their implementations, I’ve been really good things about their, you know, platform and innovations or whatever.

And she’s probably going to deduce the same thing naturally just by talking to two or three different companies that have nothing to do with it. We’ve got no skin in the game on what course she ends up picking, right? But what happens is, is that’s the relationship that we’ve, we’ve developed. And eventually there’s probably something to say, Hey, yeah, actually, Tracy, did you know that we do that?

Oh, I had no idea. Cool. Let’s talk about it. And off we go, right? Right.

Josh: it’s, Maybe one in a hundred times that I talked to her where I’m like, Oh, I actually solved that for you. Like I can, I can sell you something. It’s usually like, Oh, I have a friend. Uh, Oh, I have, you know, I heard about this. Oh, actually, you know what?

We have another customer who did that. I should connect you with them. You should have a conversation with them. Um, and it, it just, it does. It takes time and you really have to be genuine about it. But I do think that that’s one of the superpowers that we can have is, I know it sounds silly, and this is where we’re getting to the [00:46:00] kumbayanas of Scott and I chatting for an hour, but like superpower of our industry is collaboration, right?

And I think the people that are really succeeding are the ones that are, are putting that at the forefront. And they’re just saying, like, I’m going to find the key people that I really trust and respect. And I’m going to build a strong network out of that. And I’m going to have you know, my strategic conversations with each of them and collectively gather that feedback and kind of assess the entire ecosystem to see how can I to the best of my ability within my legacy contracts, within the stuff I’ve already got within the vendors I’ve already got, like how can I make the most of what I’ve got?

Yeah.

Scott: I mean, one thing I’m challenging my team with this year too, is like help customers build out and it may be a multi year plan, unfortunately, because of how contract dates line up, but like figure out that multi year strategy plan with the customer, right? Like sit down with them and say, okay, Hey, like, here’s some certain things that [00:47:00] you’re struggling with, prioritize them, look at contract end dates, and then figure out.

How we can slowly help them dig out of it because it is possible, but what makes it impossible is when we keep re upping and redoing the same thing we know we shouldn’t be doing. Right. And then you’re just inevitably pushing it out indefinitely. Right. Um, versus like, let’s slowly chip away at that iceberg and eventually get there and make, again, likely going to take several years to do.

Um, unless you’ve got super deep pockets and can just pay all the early penalty fees, which I don’t know of any credit union bank that can do that today. Um, Then yes, let’s build a plan around it and slowly methodically, you know, and intentionally do it. Um, and then you get out, get out pretty quick.  

Josh: Um, so you gave one example. I want to, I want to shift gears a little bit and I want to talk about the stuff that, like I said, you’re, you’re my go to expert on. Um, dude, man, I tell you what, whether it’s digital or physical, I, I hate to say it, but I feel like it’s in the top three every single conversation I have with a community FI [00:48:00] right now, they’re talking about losing money.

Um, and it’s in one way or another in man,

Scott: Mm hmm.

Josh: I don’t know about you, but just like one of my biggest pet peeves is a thief. Like just taking somebody, you know, something from somebody who worked hard for it. Like it just, it just like rows me the wrong way. So I’m like really bitter about this for a lot of reasons, but it’s just, I feel like our poor FIs man are just getting hit in every.

facet with all sorts of different fraud and crimes. And like you said, I mean, there’s everything from the super sophisticated stuff to just some redneck grabbing a freaking tractor and hot wiring it from John Deere next door to your branch, driving it across the street, lasso in your frigging ATM and dragging it down the street.

Like, I’m like, man, you’re sitting here trying to like think about super sophisticated fraud modeling tools. You think you’ve solved it all. And then some jack wagon steals a John Deere and rips your ATM out and you’re out a bunch of money. Like [00:49:00] they’re getting hit on a lot of different levels. What kinds of stuff are you seeing?  

Scott: Uh, I’m seeing a potential workforce that could be, if they were contributing to society, it could be really helpful.

Josh: Like you could use that tractor to go like build some homes for habitat for humanity or something like,

Scott: Yeah. Or like these guys, they’re good. Right. They’re sophisticated at, at these attacks and  there’s not using it to build society. If that’s the, that’s the sucky part. Right. But that’s my other soapbox is like, dang it. Like we need these people to be well intended and that life could be different. Um, man, I don’t know.

The one that hits home really crazy lately is, um, go ahead.

Josh: Oh no, I was, you just, you would find this inter entertaining. So, you know, I cva, our CEO, you know, is very intelligent individual, so you don’t really get ones by him. And somebody tried calling him and frauding him recently. And he was just in one of those spicy moods. And so he just kind of like ran with it for a while and played with them.

Long [00:50:00] story short, Scott, he literally got to the like end of the chain where he was talking to the whatever, like owner of this fraud ring, like the top dog. Right. And finally it came out that Siva like, wasn’t going to fall for this. Right.

Scott: Right.

Josh: And so then, so it gets all spicy with the guy and it’s like, Like, to your point, he’s like, dude, this is so elaborate what you’ve concocted.

Like this, you’re, you’re using very sophisticated technology. He’s like, I’m really impressed. Like why aren’t you doing good with this? Like you’re risking getting thrown in prison forever. You’re very intelligent. Like do something productive with it. And you know what? The guy told him, Scott, the guy was like, look, dude, here’s the deal.

He’s like, I can’t remember what it was, but it was gross. It was something like he was saying he makes like a hundred grand a week on this scam.

Scott: Yeah.

Josh: And he’s like, and I have like 10 people working for me. I pay them pennies and he’s like, I am [00:51:00] raking it in  and I’m a small fish in the fraud pond. He’s like, they’re never going to come for me.

He’s like, so no, screw you dude. I’m gonna keep doing what I’m doing. Thanks for trying to get me to be a good person. He’s like, I’m not going to, I make too much money. This is way too great of a lifestyle. Bye. And hangs up on him. And so it was just like, be a good human. Yeah,

Scott: Ugh. Yeah.

Josh: But anyway, sorry, continue.

You’re saying one of the ones you’re seeing a lot of is. Yeah.

Scott: lot. I think the frustrating part on that same note is like, so we got this guy. He was doing some skimming, um, at a credit union up in the Pacific Northwest. Actually caught him though. So like, we’re like, Nine times out of 10 you just catch the skimming device later and you throw it away or you give it to the FBI or whatever and it’s done deal.

But you never find the people that did it right. This time, like we actually stayed up, like we watched, caught the guy. I got a video of like the guy comes [00:52:00] back. Um, he’s in the middle of like removing the skimming device. The police are chasing him through, they catch him, they tackle him in the parking lot.

Like it’s this whole like movie scene, right? We’re a high five. I’m like, Oh my gosh, we finally got this. Let’s go. Um, and sure enough, we can’t hold him like, Oh, well, there’s not enough evidence this and that and blah, blah, blah. It’s like, Oh my gosh. So finally, like we kind of keep going and Levi was working with the Homeland Security on this.

They finally catch the guy coming back in from Canada through like New York, I guess. And like through facial rec, they ended up catching him actually apprehending him got to a point where actually got to be able to extradite him back to Washington or Oregon. Um, but like you had to like go through some crazy hoops.

In order to prove that he was doing financial crimes in order to stick him with anything. Otherwise it’s like literally a slap on the wrist and you’re on your way. And the guy’s back next week taking hundreds of thousands of dollars from these banks and credit unions. Like, so to me, like, I think not to get political on you, but like, it’s totally a politics issue.

Like you’ve got to have these people like [00:53:00] actually thrown in prison, like for a long time for doing this crap. Otherwise, to your point, There’s zero risk. Like, I can make hundreds of thousands of dollars a week, and worst case, I get a misdemeanor on my, on my, on my record, and I don’t even live in the United States anyways, and so I’m just gonna go back and come back and do it some other way, and it’s just like, so to me, I think that’s the biggest problem, unfortunately, because there’s so many, to your point, whether it’s phone fraud, ATM fraud, actually robbing banks still, like, whatever it is, check fraud, you name it.

Like there’s so many avenues to rip off banks and credit unions today and there’s no real consequences or really good ways to actually catch them in doing it and prove it. Um, that’s just going to get worse to your point. Like, I don’t know. So yeah, we’re seeing it all over the board. Um, the latest, which is super sick actually is we’re seeing criminals actually target our technicians.

Like we had so many people last year, which is scary. Like guns pulled on them. Like, [00:54:00] I like, and, and over, you know, opening up the ATM, like they’ll purposely go in there, jam an ATM, cause a service call, wait for our guy to show up, open the ATM up and then grab all the cash from him and run away. It’s like, geez, man, like to me, I guess shocker sometimes that, you know, customers, again, not self serving, but still have ATMs because it’s such a liability for everybody.

Even our site, like it’s so bad. So I don’t know, like the number of, uh, fraud and ways to commit fraud against banks and credit unions today is very long list, right? Unfortunately, our goal and our hope is again, like why we do what we do is to try to find innovative ways to stop that cat and mouse game once and for all, and like get ahead of them through layered security approaches, through other ways so that they don’t ever mess with our customers because they know it’s not going to work out.

Um, and the good thing is, like I said, we’ve had some really cool success stories where we’ve, we’ve done this and it’s really exciting. And I think where we’re going is even more exciting cause there’s some really cool ways where you can now do some crowdsourcing of the information and actually work with other [00:55:00] FIs instead of just having a siloed.

Um, and I honestly don’t think we’re too far off with that because of some of the technology that’s evolving to where we’re gonna be able to do some pretty cool things here, um, this year. I’m hoping so.

Josh: You know, that, um, that makes me think of a saying that Siva says all the time, too. And he’ll be the first one to tell you, like, he hates that this is what he has to say. Right? Like, we wish the answer was just, solve it, and nobody was a bad person and didn’t steal. But you know, uses the analogy of, um, you know, if you’re running from a bear, you don’t really have to outrun the bear.

You just have to outrun your friend.

Scott: You’re right.

Josh: uh, and so, um, if you can just be, if the fraudsters go to you and you’re kind of a pain in the butt to steal from, they’re going to go look for somebody that’s easier, right? They’re going to look for an easier target. And as horrible as that sounds like, I think that is a part of a proper.

Approach is just to your point. Like we’re never going to stay a hundred percent ahead of them, right? We have to be right. A hundred percent of the time. All they have to do is get [00:56:00] lucky once. Um, and when we deal with humans, human error and just being human, right? We’re never going to be perfect. So, you know, we’re never going to be a hundred percent.

Scott: optimistically though, I would say though, it’s like if the United States in general got ahead of the curve, cause we’re so far behind Europe and Asia and like those other continents, like if we can legit do a good job here, they’ll go elsewhere. Meaning out of the country, like, You’re gonna hate it to say I don’t want anyone getting fraud, right?

But like

Josh: Yeah,

Scott: out of the United States, like go do fraud in another country. But it’s the reality. Like there’s no penalties really here and the technology is so far behind. It’s an easy pick.

Josh: yeah, well, and that’s, what’s scary to me. Scott is again, going back to what we were talking about earlier. I hate to keep bringing up AI, but like the advancements in technology, again, we’re, we’re crazy to think that the fraudsters aren’t using this stuff too.

Scott: Oh yeah.

Josh: And they’re getting even more and

Scott: very easily. [00:57:00] Yeah. I said I could be Josh Tatar tomorrow very

Josh: Yeah.

Scott: I could clone your face, your voice, your mannerisms. I can make it happen. Like

Josh: It’s terrifying. Yeah. And so again, like we’re just, it’s, it’s getting that much more difficult to be right a hundred percent of the time, but it’s, what can we do to make, you know, shore up all of our defenses, put as much of a moat around us as possible where they’re like, Hey, look, like I ATM that didn’t work.

I tried to discard skim them. That didn’t work. You know, I tried to do, um, account takeover fraud and digital banking. That didn’t work. Honestly, like I’m not trying the fourth time. There’s somebody easier to go steal from. I’m going over there.

Scott: Move on. Yes.

Josh: and again, like I said, I agree with you. Like I hate to send it somewhere else, but at least if I can protect what I can protect and the people that I can protect, like, I guess that’s a win, right?

Scott: Yeah, yeah, [00:58:00] gotta take a little wins. I mean to point like that’s what we’re that’s what we got so excited about catching that one guy It’s like yes like Validation that at least all these efforts right even if we’re not catching everything catching one is better than nothing and we’re moving on The cool thing about this is you talk to our director of our network operation center I mean, we’re getting some pretty cool consistent wins over and over so like to us.

It’s like it’s exciting that Hey, the ideas are working. Things are paying off. We’re gonna start building on those blocks, building on the momentum. Um, and keep, keep moving at it cause it’s working. So, um, yeah, time will tell.

Josh: uh, mutual friend of ours, Mr. Jason Thomas, and I have

Scott: Oh yeah.

Josh: a text string of one of our favorite things to do is when we get those like fraudsters is seeing who can lead them on the longest.

Scott: Oh yeah.

Josh: is with that mindset of like, maybe I can annoy them enough that they’ll give up for the day and not get somebody that actually would have fallen for it.

Scott: Right. That’s

Josh: what I mean?

Scott: Yeah. Yeah.

Josh: so yeah, we have this whole thing where we try and lead [00:59:00] them on as long as we can so that they don’t have time to go get somebody who actually would have fallen for it and

Scott: I’m glad I’m not the only one

Josh: their life choices.

Scott: It drives my wife crazy. She’s like, why are you even talking to them? I’m like, because it’s so fun. Sometimes it’s

Josh: Yeah. Sometimes it’s like, to your point, like it’s a little satisfying to get a win against these jerks. Like, I don’t know. So, okay, now this, this actually opens up, um, before we started recording, you said, one of the things you wanted to talk to me about was payments. And you’re like, I don’t know how we even weave this into the conversation.

But what’s funny is you gave me exactly the end of this is I think one of the problems too, that we face Scott is that there are so many ways to access, move and leverage money in the U S and that’s a part of the problem is like if you have. Okay, here, bear with me here. So my wife and I, for whatever reason, like we got on the train of re watching Game of Thrones recently.

Scott: Oh,

Josh: And so, [01:00:00] we’re going back through and watching Game of Thrones. And, um, And I just made this joke the other night because they’re like storming this, uh, city and they go into like the little, um, you know, like water drainage gate and they break in through that. There’s no guards and everything. And I was like, why do you idiots all have these doors? Like

Scott: Everyone knows, yeah.

Josh: stop. Like everyone knows you all have this like service access gate that’s unprotected. Like just don’t have those. You know what I mean? Or if you have one, at least put a guard on it. Like, come on,

Scott: Yeah, yeah,

Josh: But, when you’ve got a hundred doors to guard, it’s a lot harder than guarding one door. And when we’ve got ATMs for cash, when we’ve got checks and check fraud, when you’ve got debit cards for skimming and for just stealing the number because you’re a server at a restaurant and you grab it and you start doing some online shopping [01:01:00] to, Hey, I’m going to log into your digital banking account as you and start siphoning money out and ACH ing myself.

Right. Like we have so many different ways to move money. We also have so many different ways to steal money.

Scott: Yep.

Josh: so as we start

Scott: that don’t talk to each other. Yeah.

Josh: yeah. And systems that don’t talk to each other, right? Like if perfect case in point, like let’s say we have somebody who we know has a lot grabbed a tractor and ripped ATMs out of walls at credit unions around the street. Well, if we know that that person is trying to log into digital banking, I don’t know. That’s probably a pretty good person to block. They’re probably a pretty sucky person,

Scott: Yep, yep.

Josh: we don’t have that Intel.  We don’t have that data sharing. And so as we start to get more,

Scott: um, yeah, go ahead.

Josh: Oh, no, um, yeah, as we start to get systems that are more interconnected and [01:02:00] as we start to pare down potentially the number of different ways to move money and transact, that’s actually a good thing from a security standpoint. 

Scott: Yeah, fair. Yeah. I was going to say, we’d started to do some facial rec now, which I know facial rec sometimes is like this bad word of people think like big brother and whatnot, but without actually saying like, Hey, that’s Scott Fieber at the ATM. We can just say, Hey, this is a known bad guy. That’s it.

Like, it’s just almost like bad guy detector. You just upload the images and then again, to your site detect that. So if I see that person at the ATM, Let’s just not allow them to take cash out. Or for two point, I see that person tried to log into the app, not allow it. Right. Or like, I don’t know. There’s some fun things I think with biometrics.

Um, that’s starting to kind of get that same way of, but again, got to have the data in the same spot and not have a disparate everywhere. So, um, yeah, I think it’s, you’re on something for sure. 

Josh: Yeah. I mean, it is just, we have so many different ways to move money and a lot of our traditional systems move on legacy technology and [01:03:00] move really slow.

Scott: Yep.

Josh: again, you know, we can go back to our medieval analogies here, right? Like, it’s a lot harder to steal the gold when it’s in the vault in the castle. But if you’re moving it from one castle to another, it’s a lot easier to steal it in

Scott: Pickens. Yeah.

Josh: Especially if it’s out on the road for a couple of days, right? It’s a lot

Scott: I’ve been thinking about the Fast and Furious movie now.

Josh: Yeah, there’s a fast Vin Diesel’s coming in at some point here, but it’s a lot easier to steal this stuff when it’s in transit and it’s like, Hey, I sent the money. Now we need to go validate with this system. Then we need to go check this system and then it’s going to take two days and then it’s going to post this system and then we’ll take it out of this system. During that time period, there’s a lot of opportunity for somebody to monkey with that system or to alter records, right? [01:04:00] Whereas as we start to see the advent of true instant payments and money movement where it moves and settles in seconds, again, you’re just closing down some of these doors for people to actually steal money.

Scott: Yeah. Is that, I guess, challenge the question back? Like, what are you, is there any way to do that properly today that you can think of? Or is it all, I mean, none of the current systems that I can think of are doing anything about that. Right. Are they? 

Josh: I mean, not at a tied together level is the problem,

Scott: Yeah.

Josh: right? Um, but I think,

Scott: don’t have a ton of money because I feel like I would lose it so fast. I would do something stupid that would get, get lost so quickly. Like, well, that was fun while it lasted.

Josh: is that, yeah, isn’t that the truth? It goes back to like the whole, uh, the guy, like I’m the small fish in the pond. And I’m like, I’m less concerned that somebody is going to steal from me, I guess. Cause I don’t have millions of dollars.

Scott: Sure. Yeah.

Josh: Yeah, [01:05:00] well, Scott, you know, one of the other things I wanted to, we’re going to take a massive left turn, but one of the other things that I wanted to talk to you about before I turn you loose on your night is I wanted to give you an opportunity to talk a little bit about the nonprofit that you and your wife, um, have started.

And again, like this industry is one that just, it always surprises me. And I think in a good way, in the way that people respond and, and really rally together and build community and do good. Um, so I just think this would be a great opportunity for you to talk. About a different way that if people are interested in this type of cause, they could do some good.

So if you’re open to it, I’d love for you to share a little bit about what you guys are

Scott: Yeah. Um, so the nonprofit’s called Unlimits Aid. Unlimit Dash Aid is probably, I didn’t, I didn’t consult any marketing firm on that name. So it’s not the best, but it’s actually funny when you try to hear people say it in Spanish because what we do is a lot of this stuff is in Central America. It’s, um, no one can say it down there either.

So we probably need to rebrand at some point, [01:06:00] but, um, but yeah, um, so out of high school, I went down and lived in El Salvador for two years and just grew to love the people down there. Um, but also saw a lot of the struggles, um, For people that don’t know, like the MS 13 gang, which is like one of the, I think last I heard the biggest gang in the world, um, started out of El Salvador, El Salvador had some crazy like civil war issues in like the eighties, nineties, um, have since come a long ways and clearing all that up.

But the gang presence down there is still insane. Um, and it’s just kind of spread through Guatemala, Mexico, even the United States is, is a big deal. Um, and so when I was down there, like I’ve seen some heartbreaking things with just kids that never had a fighting chance at success. Like, all they’ve known was, even, and the crazy thing is like, the public school system down there, is a prime recruiting ground for gangs.

And so like, it’s so sad to see it. Um, and so, yeah, I mean, probably about eight years ago or so, my wife and I finally started this nonprofit to say, Hey, let’s find, this is part of me. Like [01:07:00] part of me is I always go big when I go, like I should probably learn better, but like my wife grounded me. She’s like, well, let’s just find one kid to help.

And I’m like, okay. So we went down there, interviewed some schools, interviewed some families and kids. Obviously couldn’t say no to any of them. So like we started out with like seven kids, their first year of kids that are primed to go down a wrong path unless we step in. And so we stepped in and our main goal is to get them out of the public school system and into a private education to where They can kind of see that there’s different life outside of gangs and drugs and other things.

So a lot of these kids are just at risk kids that, you know, have broken homes or, um, a struggle of some sort that we like to help them out with. Um, it was pretty gratifying to see like last year was our first year that we grew up. We graduated four students from high school, um, which was super satisfying.

There’s been some heartbreaking things along the way too. We haven’t helped everybody that we wanted to. Um, But yeah, this last November, a couple of months ago, we took 16 kids from the United States down and did some service projects and worked and kind of celebrated [01:08:00] their, their school year. Their school year actually goes from late January to early or late October.

It’s like their summer break is November, December. Um, so we went down and kind of did a end of year celebration with all the kids and, um, and they did some service work and kind of helped the kids from here networking grow between the, between, um, The different countries and stuff. So that was a lot of fun.

But um, so yeah, this year we’re growing even bigger We have the biggest class ever this year. And so It’s fun to see that and it’s fun to think I think you know Not to put like christ and god into this but I will because i’m a big big believer But it’s it’s crazy to see how like we just say yes And worry about the finances later.

Um, like everything we do is through donations and through just self funding that my wife and I do. And, um, every year I get that bill for tuition and for books and uniforms and whatever else these kids need to, to do their thing for the year. And I’m like, oh crap, there’s no way we’re going to build a family.

And then I always get a phone call from someone saying, Hey, Scott, I saw, can we donate? And it’s always the amount of money we need. Like it’s, it’s just a miracle every single year. And it’s so cool to see it. Um, so yes, my, my goal in [01:09:00] life is to retire as soon as possible. Although I love banking, but to go out and just help these kids full time and, and, uh, keep the cause going, uh, beyond what we’re doing now.

But it’s, it’s cool. So yeah, if anyone’s interested in learning about these kids and, um, getting to know more of them and being part of it, we’re happy to, happy to help bring you along either on a trip or help financially or just let you know. We do, we actually do monthly zoom calls with them too, just kind of help give these kids perspective too.

So if you have any experience and you want to share the experience with kids, like there’s so much more than just donating money to the cause that can be such a huge help for the kids. So, um, yeah, thanks for asking. It’s, uh, definitely obviously it’s, it’s our heart there. So.

Josh: Well, yeah. I appreciate what you’re doing. I mean, it’s needed and we talk about trying to solve

Scott: it’s, it’s, man, it’s, it’s, it’s rewarding well beyond anything else that we do just to kind of see the impact you have on these kids. Cause again, I know exactly where they’d be had we not stepped in like a hundred percent, um, cause I’ve seen it. Um, and it’s, it’s pretty cool. Pretty cool. So

Josh: [01:10:00] That’s crazy, man. Well, uh, let us know how we can help. Thank you for taking a minute to share. That leads me to two mental questions for you. Um, so one, just where do you go to get information about what’s happening in the industry? What keeps you up to date? Yeah.

Scott: on reading articles and, um, Things like that. Um, and I’m not, um, so honestly, a lot of what I hear is honestly from customers and peers and contacts like you, just, you kind of hear about it very quickly. Like, Oh, and so so and so got acquired or, Hey, this company’s came about, or, Hey, this just happened.

Um, so it’s honestly just like, through my peer network of hearing things. Um, Which is probably the good source of truth though, to be honest. Like, you’re going to go through the, the, the BS sometimes you read online, but, um, so yeah, that’s, that’s not a good answer probably. I definitely don’t say like, I subscribe to this channel, uh, or that channel or this, you know, whatever.

But it’s, um, I do subscribe to your podcast now, though, after the invite. So

Josh: What’s like that?

Scott: this will be my new source. This will be my new source of information for today.[01:11:00] 

Josh: Well, and then if people want to connect with you either on the work front and want to talk about, um, you know, anything that they’re seeing in terms of, um, you know, some needs they have for their financial institution, or if they just want to connect with you on a personal level, learn a little bit more about what you’re doing with the nonprofit.

Um, how can people get ahold of you, connect with you and how can they learn more about cook solutions group?

Scott: Yeah, I mean, obviously reach out to me personally. I’m happy to help on any level there. Um, our website’s a good spot from all things CSG. Um, our newsletter is quirky and fun at the same time. Like people, it’s funny, the analytics we get on our newsletter, everyone likes our beer blog and it’s at the very bottom because of that reason.

You have to go through all of our CSG stuff. To get to the beer box. Um, but, uh, yeah, um, you know, my cell phone’s out there. I’ll give it to anybody that wants it. 801 580 1089. You can call me, text me whatever. Um, and we’re there to, there to help. So, um, but yeah, CSG, like I said, we’re, that’s one of the reasons why I work at CSG and not some of these other companies is like, I feel CSG is [01:12:00] in line with me morally.

Right. Like I’ve seen Brian, our owner do the right thing over and over and over again for customers. Um, even though it doesn’t make any sense financially for us to do it. Um, and so that, that aligns with me a hundred percent and that’s why I’m here and while I’ll be here for a very long time, um, because of that.

So, um, yeah. So if you’re looking for, you know, a company that wants to do, do the right thing by you and collaborate with you and you know, we’re the, we’re one of those, one of those good guys.

Josh: I agree. I’ll appreciate you taking some time on your day to come hang out and chat. It’s always good to see you. It’s always good to talk, but thanks for doing on a recording and thanks for being on the digital banking podcast. Scott,

Scott: Hey, thanks for having me. Definitely need to catch up. I’ll wear the gold jacket next time, I promise.

Josh: please do I’ll see you later.

Scott: Alright, take care. Thanks. 

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